Sunday, November 20, 2016

Goodbye Sam Harris


"The first thing a man will do for his ideals is lie."
    — Joseph A. Schumpeter, 'History of Economic Analysis (New York: Oxford University Press, 1954)', p. 43n

"When analyzing fallacies, I have thought it still less advisable to mention particular names than in giving credit.  To do so would have required special justice to each writer criticized, with exact quotations, account taken of the particular emphasis he places on this point or that, the qualifications he makes, his personal ambiguities, inconsistencies, and so on."
    — Henry Hazlitt, 'Economics In One Lesson (New York: Harper & Brothers Publishers, 1946)', p. 11, Preface


In a previous post, I wrote about some of the problems with Sam Harris's attacks on Donald Trump —
     http://maxautonomy.blogspot.com/2016/11/the-sam-harris-fail.html

I've offered no defense of Trump (in that post or any other) — I simply pointed out that Sam Harris's attack on Trump is an ad hominem fallacy, despite Harris's repeated denial of this obvious criticism.

In a podcast from October 26, 2016, Sam Harris complained at length regarding the numerous criticisms he has received for his attacks on Trump, even discussing the ad hominem, and why any uses of that fallacy in an argument are rightly despised.

Here is a partial transcript of that podcast, where Harris attempts to address the most common criticism he has received for his attack on Trump —

https://www.samharris.org/podcast/item/the-lesser-evil
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcWmpHsszbg&t=4m3s   (segment begins at 4:03)
. . .
Now, this brings me to the most frequent criticism I've heard.  And this is yet another example of a catchphrase of sorts, distorting people's thinking.  What I've now heard more times than I can count, is some variant of the following:
'You used to be such a careful thinker, but when you talk about Trump, all you produce are ad hominems.  This shows that you are arguing from pure emotion, not reason.'
Again, I've received that every conceivable way.   You know, people have made videos on that point,   I've got   e-mails, every comment thread I've seen has got some version of this.  Um, OK.  The ad hominem fallacy — 'ad hominem' means 'to the man'.  One commits this fallacy, when rather than address an argument, or an idea, you merely attack its source.  And this technique, if we can call it that, is rightly despised.  It's not a valid form of argumentation.

For instance, when Donald Trump says that 'we shouldn't let Muslims into the country, because of the risk of terrorism', it is ad hominem to say 'Donald Trump is a bigot', full stop.  As though that were an adequate response to the policy argument.  Whether or not he is a bigot, is irrelevant to the question of whether it's wise or necessary to attempt to keep Muslims out of the country.  If you want to argue against that, as I have, you need to say things like: 'it's impractical, or it's impossible, you know many of these people come from countries in Europe, for instance, just where and how are you going to apply a religious test to people from England, and France, and Germany.  Or that it's needlessly inflammatory, and will prove counterproductive.  Or that you'd be keeping out the very allies you need in your fight against extremism.   Or that this would violate some deeper value, like the value of helping kids who are being pulverized in a civil war, through no fault of their own.

You have to say something that deals with the claim.  And so it is with any policy position, he or anyone else might articulate.  And I've done that — so far as Trump has said anything concrete, and not immediately self-contradictory about what he intends to do, I have addressed those issues.  But what I have mainly been talking about, is whether or not Trump should be President.  And whether or not he's a bigot, is relevant to that question.  Many of his qualities as a person, and certainly most of his intellectual and moral qualities, are relevant to that question.

So, when I say of Trump, that he shouldn't be President, because he's dangerously uniformed, and, even in many respects, unintelligent — and he's a pathological liar, not an ordinary liar, but a liar of a sort you'd expect to meet only in a mental hospital — and that he's a deeply unethical person, one who is actually famous for treating people terribly — and that he's an anti-intellectual, someone who has no respect for real knowledge, much less the life of the mind — someone, for instance, who could perpetrate a fraud like Trump University, and not want to kill himself out of shame — and that he's a sexual predator, not merely married to one — and, yes, that he is very likely also a bigot — and that he is above all a bully and a con man, an obvious con man, the most obvious con man I have ever seen in public life.  None of this is an example of an ad hominem fallacy.  I've argued that giving Donald Trump more responsibility than any person on earth, is a bad idea because of who he is, because of the bad qualities he has in spades, and because of the good ones he so obviously lacks.
. . .


That almost sounds good, until you remember that the title of Sam Harris's podcast quoted above is 'The Lesser Evil'.  And in the context of demonstrating that one candidate is the worst of two, even if you can prove that one candidate is a 'pathological liar', as Harris claims regarding Trump, you must also prove the other candidate does not lie, or, at a minimum, has been less destructive in their lying — that is, you must perform a thorough comparison of the actions of the two candidates, and the outcomes those kinds of actions will most likely lead to in the future.

This is a very tall order, and both Sam Harris and Andrew Sullivan fail in their attempt to do this in Harris's podcast — that is, they avoid the critical effort in their discussion, by failing to perform a comparison of the most likely outcomes based on the past actions of Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton.  Harris's and Sullivan's denunciations do not contain an argument, and are useless in doing an honest and meaningful comparison of Trump and Hillary.

Denouncing a Presidential candidate, based on your subjective view of his character flaws is fine — but it is a pure ad hominem fallacy as part of an argument that his actions are worse than another's.  The comparison of action is critical in demonstrating that a particular candidate is the lesser of anything — whereas Harris and Sullivan only provide a subjective denunciation and the insistence that one of the two is dramatically worse.

Andrew Sullivan is actually comical in this regard.  Near the end of Harris's podcast, Harris attempts to get more detail from Sullivan on why Trump really is the greater evil, and Sullivan goes on in melodramatic and hyperbolic terms about how a Trump presidency will end U.S. democracy, while making no attempt to demonstrate any of his apocalyptic claims, and of course, a dismissal of where Obama and Hillary Clinton have behaved similarly, just as when Harris dismissed the corruption revealed by the Podesta e-mails as just 'how the sausage get's made'

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcWmpHsszbg&t=54m42s   (segment begins at 54:42)
. . .
Sam Harris: "... Like the Wikileaks e-mails, my reading of them thus far, is that there is really not much there that is surprising.  I mean, like, how did you think the sausage was getting made, and what did you think the private communications in a campaign would look like?  Right?  I mean there are things there that we wish wouldn't be there, we wish people wouldn't operate this way, but there's nothing there that I've seen that is fundamentally shocking, or that tells us something we don't know, or didn't know, or that would be disqualifying to her candidacy."

Andrew Sullivan: "No, I agree.  What's shocking however, is that people's private correspondence can be hacked and delivered this way.  And I think the ability for politics to function at all, for government to function at all does require some lack of transparency.  Any organization has to have something that's private, so that it can actually function."

Sam Harris: "But that is sort of a point in her favor.  The Trump phenomenon is also a point in her favor.  To go back to the comment you made a few minutes ago, that one of the things that is odious about her is that she believes you have to have a public and private conversation which are distinct, because the people can't handle the truth.  There's so little appetite, or ability, for honest reasoning that people will seize upon your words, like the way she was using the phrase 'open borders' in context, as opposed to the way those words can be made to seem, and you'll never become President, or you'll never achieve the office you're seeking, because people are stupid and cynical, and the truth will be used against you, so you have to focus group everything.
. . .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcWmpHsszbg&t=110m45s   (segment begins at 1:50:45)
. . .
Sam Harris: "So just to put a fine point on this, because given all of the heinous things we have said about the Clintons, and Hillary in particular, why does it matter that she be in charge, as opposed to him?  I mean when you just imagine going forward in dealing with Russia or China, or the problem of jihadism, or anything else, any other challenge we're going to face, why do you feel that there really is a difference here worth caring about?  Because many people think, they're both liars, they both, you know, her husband is a rapist, he's a rapist, at the very least they're both trailing accusations of rape.  There is ugliness on both sides."

Andrew Sullivan: "Because he uniquely threatens our entire political system, from within, and he uniquely threatens global stability in a way that no president, no candidate for president, has ever done in this country.  Just because we haven't been here before, there is this amazing complacency about what can happen in a democracy.  And if you've read history, and you see this happening, it's textbook for how democracies perish.  It, it is incredibly dangerous, at a level completely outside any previous candidate for the presidency, uh, outside anything in American history, short of the 1860s."

Sam Harris: "But spell that out a little more — it's outside any precedent with respect to ... "

Andrew Sullivan: "To the basic rules of liberal democracy, the basic core constructing ideas that make us the West.

Sam Harris: "But .. I mean, it's, it's outside any precedent in terms of his disrespect for the institutions, and his complete unawareness of what's going on in the world.  I mean he's an ignoramus, and a narcissistic bully, who just wants to crash through every impediment he finds, and many of those impediments are our democratic system."

Andrew Sullivan: "Yes, and we've seen for example, that this so powerful in him, that he will continue to do this even though it sabotages himself.  So, a man, if he were to be president, we would be the people he would be sabotaging.  Our society would be what he would be casting asunder.  We would be yanked to and fro towards escalating conflict, internally and internationally in a way that we have never been before. This country would be torn apart, their would be violence in the streets.
. . .


In short, Harris's criticism of Trump is an ad hominem fallacy, because his denunciations in no way demonstrate the greater evil.  With respect to the claim of a greater evil, it is absolutely irrelevant that Trump is a 'pathological liar', or any other of the negative traits Sam Harris assigns — even if all of Harris's accusations regarding Trump are absolutely true, it does nothing to show that Hillary Clinton is superior in any of the same respects.

Let's be clear — the problem here has little to do with Harris's denunciations of Trump.  The problem is that Harris expects readers and listeners to accept his adjective laden invective and analogy as some kind of scientific proof.

Paraphrasing Harris: 'Trump is a pathological liar such as the type you would find in a mental hospital — Trump has no respect for real knowledge — Trump has a thought process resembling a deflating balloon running chaotically in all directions — Trump's Presidential bid is akin to a five foot obese man thinking he rightly belongs on a basketball team.', etc.  Well, this is colorful language, but it reveals much more about what Sam Harris thinks is an appropriate way to critique someone, than it reveals about Donald Trump.

Notice the quote from Henry Hazlitt at the top of this blog post, regarding the special requirements to treat an individual fairly, if you wished to criticize them for repeating a particular fallacy — do you think Sam Harris has met this standard in his denunciations of Trump?  As I pointed out in my previous post, Harris took no pains to represent Trump accurately — just as he did not in the quotes below, from his podcast on November 10, 2016, where he stated that Trump recommended nuclear proliferation.

For just one example, think about what it would take to prove someone is a 'pathological liar', as Harris claims of Trump — it is not enough to merely show them lying, you have to show that they lie compulsively, as a matter of habit.

In this post, I called Hillary a liar (in the title), because I'm convinced that the 13 minute video I included showing her lying, is ample proof of at least that much
     http://maxautonomy.blogspot.com/2016/08/lying-about-hillary-clintons-lies.html

Hillary does seem pathological to me, because she repeatedly makes false statements.   But notice that I did not make the accusation that Hillary is pathological, because it is just my subjective opinion, and, even more, I know that the 13 minute video I included does not demonstrate that she is pathological — it only demonstrates that Hillary lies repeatedly.  If Sam Harris provided even remotely the same evidence to justify his denunciations of Trump, I might believe him — whereas, now I just see Harris as attempting to rationalize an obvious bias.

Sam Harris, 'pathological liar' ad hominem


https://twitter.com/SamHarrisOrg/status/796025058422452224




Here is a Sam Harris tweet from October 16, 2016, where Sam again insists that his denunciations are not an ad hominem, because he was attempting to show that Trump is the 'greater evil'.  If you think Harris made an effective comparison between Trump and Hillary, as many of his readers seem to, then you accept this claim.  But again, attacks on an individual do not constitute a comparison, and a comparison is required to justify any claim of greater or lesser.  Calling someone a 'pathological liar', or 'a narcissist', or 'a bully', or a whatever, etc., neither proves those accusations, nor demonstrates that the subject possesses those qualities to any greater degree than anyone else —

https://twitter.com/SamHarrisOrg/status/787746752761765890




Here is a transcript of Sam Harris's podcast from November 10, 2016, entitled 'The Most Powerful Clown'.  Again, it is primarily emotional invective, and reflects more on Sam Harris's character than on Trump's.  I added a few comments, to point out some (but by no means all) of the falsehoods in Harris's statements, to show that if you are inclined to believe that Sam Harris does not misrepresent others when it suites him, you would be wrong —

https://www.samharris.org/podcast/item/the-most-powerful-clown
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wthdOF32VKQ

The Most Powerful Clown
Sam Harris   NOV 10, 2016
Well it has come to pass.  President Trump.  A man who many of us treated as a buffoon, and only took seriously as a threat at the eleventh hour, will be the 45th President of the United States.  With a Republican Congress behind him, and with at least one vacancy, probably more, on the Supreme Court, to fill.  Sooo, what went wrong? And, how bad is this?

Well, I think there are two parts to this story.  The first is unambiguously depressing.  And ... this is the part that has been seized on by most Liberals.  But it’s only half the story, and it is this; Trump has ascended to power despite showing every sign of being dangerously unfit for it.  And by exposing in himself, and in the electorate the worst that America has to offer.  Racism, sexism, anti-semitism, a contempt for the most vulnerable among us, intimations of fascism, a positive love of bullying, total disdain for our democratic institutions, a willingness to make threats of political violence, just for the fun of it, a contempt for science, and a love of conspiracy theories.  I mean I can run through it all again, the crazy things he said and the toxic alliances he’s made.  The irony is if he had been merely half as bad, he would have seemed worse.  He would have been more recognizably dangerous.  There were so many awful moments, that the media couldn’t focus on them for long enough or weigh their significance.  And the big things were as big as they get, right, “climate change is a hoax”, “why can’t we use our nuclear weapons?”, “maybe nuclear proliferation is a good thing?”, “let the Saudis, and the Japanese, and the South Koreans build their own nukes”, “who’s to say we should support our NATO alliances, what have they done for us?”, “Putin is a great leader”, “Maybe we should just default on our debt, cut a better deal”.
. . .


Notice that Harris misrepresents Tump's comments on nuclear proliferation.  Here are links to what Trump actually said, along with a direct statement to the 'New York Times' that nuclear proliferation is the biggest problem facing the world —
      http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/27/us/politics/donald-trump-transcript.html
      http://www.breitbart.com/video/2016/03/29/trump-i-hate-proliferation-but-it-would-be-better-if-japan-saudi-...
Trump: "... Biggest problem, to me, in the world, is nuclear, and proliferation."
And as I pointed out in my previous post, Harris oversimplifies Trump's comment regarding debt to serve his agenda in denouncing him.  Trump specifically mentioned 'buying back' debt to 'refinance' it, which is actually a very common practice (also, notice again that Harris repeatedly violates the quote from Hazlitt above in misrepresenting Trump's views) —
     http://maxautonomy.blogspot.com/2016/11/the-sam-harris-fail.html

Back to 'The Most Powerful Clown'

https://www.samharris.org/podcast/item/the-most-powerful-clown
. . .
Any one of those things should have ended it.  But of course the little things were just as weird, and should have been just as disqualifying.  I mean, we have just elected a president who has bragged about invading the dressing rooms of beauty pageant contestants so that he could see them naked, when they were effectively his employees, he ... he owned the pageant.  And then he even bullied some of these young women publicly. Some on social media in the wee hours of the morning while campaigning for the presidency.  And then he denied doing any of these things, when no denial was even possible.  I mean we had all seen his tweets, and in response to the astonishment of the media, he looked the American people in the eye and said “No one respects women more than I do, no one”.  And half the country accepted that as what, the truth? As good theatre? As sketch comedy?

There are really no words to describe how far from normal we have drifted here.  David Remnick, the editor of The New Yorker, described the situation the night of the election, in a piece entitled “An American Tragedy”.  I’ll read a little of that so you get a sense of what the liberal elites were thinking at 3 AM —
"The election of Donald Trump to the Presidency is nothing less than a tragedy for the American republic, a tragedy for the Constitution, and a triumph for the forces, at home and abroad, of nativism, authoritarianism, misogyny, and racism.  Trump’s shocking victory, his ascension to the Presidency, is a sickening event in the history of the United States and liberal democracy.  On January 20, 2017, we will bid farewell to the first African-American President—a man of integrity, dignity, and generous spirit—and witness the inauguration of a con who did little to spurn endorsement by forces of xenophobia and white supremacy.  It is impossible to react to this moment with anything less than revulsion and profound anxiety."
...

"In the coming days, commentators will attempt to normalize this event.  They will try to soothe their readers and viewers with thoughts about the “innate wisdom” and “essential decency” of the American people.  They will downplay the virulence of the nationalism displayed, the cruel decision to elevate a man who rides in a gold-plated airliner but who has staked his claim with the populist rhetoric of blood and soil. ...

The commentators, in their attempt to normalize this tragedy, will also find ways to discount the bumbling and destructive behavior of the F.B.I., the malign interference of Russian intelligence, the free pass—the hours of uninterrupted, unmediated coverage of his rallies—provided to Trump by cable television, particularly in the early months of his campaign.  We will be asked to count on the stability of American institutions, the tendency of even the most radical politicians to rein themselves in when admitted to office.  Liberals will be admonished as smug, disconnected from suffering, as if so many Democratic voters were unacquainted with poverty, struggle, and misfortune.  There is no reason to believe this palaver.  There is no reason to believe that Trump and his band of associates—Chris Christie, Rudolph Giuliani, Mike Pence, and, yes, Paul Ryan—are in any mood to govern as Republicans within the traditional boundaries of decency.  Trump was not elected on a platform of decency, fairness, moderation, compromise, and the rule of law; he was elected, in the main, on a platform of resentment.  Fascism is not our future—it cannot be; we cannot allow it to be so—but this is surely the way fascism can begin."

I think most of that is true, unfortunately, but it’s not the whole truth.  And the parts that are true, are probably not worth dwelling on at this point.  I’m not sure how useful it’ll be to stay in the well of blame and despair and and to resist “normalizing” the situation but, it is true that the ‘normalizing’ seems like an act of prayer.  Just consider Trump’s victory speech, which was alarming for how un-Trumpian it was.  I mean it read like it was written by Van Jones on ambien.  It was the most anodyne bit of fence mending.  But you can feel the desperation in the media, to read into his surprisingly gracious notes.  The normalcy that Remnick is talking about here.  I mean, maybe we were all just wrong about him, right?  Maybe he’s a nice guy after all.  What are the chances of that?  Is it possible that an ethical person merely pretended to be a total asshole for 18 months?  It seems somehow farfetched.  But what a way to make of the fact that Trump had nothing but nice things to say about Clinton.  What happened to “Lock her up?”  Does anyone care about the Trump who spoke on the night of the election was totally unrecognizable?  Who did his supporters think they had elected?  Were his supporters surprised to see him merely praise Hillary?  Is it all theatre?  Who is this guy?  Will he attempt to do anything he promised to do?  Does anyone know?  Does Ivanka have any idea what her dad will do as President?
. . .


Notice that Harris's quote of David Remnick above is a kind of appeal to authority fallacy — what the 'liberal elites' were thinking?  I have no idea why Harris thinks there is such a thing as a 'liberal elite', but what anyone is thinking is completely irrelevant, unless they have a compelling argument for thinking it.

It certainly is not clear why Harris would waste his listener's time by reading David Remnick's writing into his podcast, since it adds nothing that Harris had not already said — it is just more emotional invective, without substance.

Regarding the supposed 'bumbling and destructive behavior of the F.B.I.', for example, I can only assume that this is meant to refer to the F.B.I. doing anything at all regarding Hillary Clinton — but a good case certainly cannot be made for doing nothing, since it is a trivial exercise to show that Hillary violated the law.  That is, unless you do not care about a core principle of democracy, like the rule of law (as Sam Harris and Andrew Sullivan at least pretended to be so concerned about elsewhere).   See the details here —
     http://maxautonomy.blogspot.com/2016/07/mediamatters-hillary-clintons-shill.html

Back to 'The Most Powerful Clown'

https://www.samharris.org/podcast/item/the-most-powerful-clown
. . .
Now I’ve gotten a fair amount of grief from people at this point for having been wrong about the election.  I’m not sure what they mean.   I admit I did jinx it by posting a suitably repellent picture of Trump on Twitter early in the day and say ‘Bye bye Donald’.  Of course that wasn’t a prediction, I was simply saying how nice it would be to never think about him again.  Of course when I sent that tweet the polls were giving him around a 20% chance of winning.  Now whether the polls were wrong or not is anyone's guess at this point — a 20% chance of winning is not nothing, right?  Spend a few minutes with some dice and see how often a 20% chance comes up.  It comes up quite frequently sometimes on the very first roll.  So, I jinxed the election.  Sorry about that.  But surely it can’t have been a failure of judgement to have trusted the most reputable polls.  Basically, everyone was doing that.  What else was there to trust?  Just the torrents of hatred I saw on social media?  But the story about what happened with the polls will be interesting in the weeks and months ahead.

The truth is I always had a bad feeling about the election, and that’s why I talked about it so much on this podcast.  I could tell that Hillary’s flaws as a candidate were causing people to ignore Trump’s flaws as a human being.  Well, we’re about to find out how high a price we and the rest of the world will pay for that.  Speaking personally I can say, I left more or less everything on the field.  I know I alienated many of you in how fully I disparaged Trump.  And I kept doing it even at the risk of boring those of you who actually agreed with me because I thought it was so important.  I don’t honestly see how I could have done any more, and at this moment that’s actually a good feeling.  I was preparing myself for this moment and I certainly know many scientists, business people and writers who can’t say the same.  But who knows, the fact that they held their tongues may appear fairly prudent at this moment.  We’re about to see an astonishingly vindictive man sweep to power with not many check to his power.  He has threatened to go after his enemies.  To jail Hillary, to sue the women who accused him of sexual assault, to change our libel laws, to go after the Washington Post.  Again, this is not a normal moment in American history.

Now many people ask me whether I regret not backing Bernie Sanders.  If I’m so trusting of polls, why didn’t I trust the polls that showed him to have a better chance than Clinton against Trump.  Because Sanders was totally untested, he had never been subjected to opposition research the way Clinton had.  We knew what the Republicans were going to say about Clinton.  Who knows what they would have done to Sanders.  It is true he would have drawn some of the isolationist and anti-establishment vote that went to Trump.  And perhaps he would have turned out more voters than Clinton did, and it looks like that could have been decisive.  It seems that Hillary got 6 millions fewer votes than Obama did in 2012, and 10 million fewer than he got in 2008.  So, democrats didn’t show up and I hope all those Bernie supporters who stayed home, or voted who third-party will be paying attention over the next four years.  But I share the view that the election was generally a repudiation of the left, and the political correctness in particular as much as it was just a vote for change.  It was a repudiation of black and brown identity politics by white identity politics and it’s important to point out that this isn’t the same as racism.  I don’t believe that the majority of the people who voted for Trump were motivated by racism.  There are people who voted for Obama twice who voted for Trump.  Racism cannot be the best way to explain that.  This is where the prevailing analysis on the left is wrong, of the sort that I just read from David Remnick in the New Yorker.

Yes, we have just elected a man who was officially endorsed by the Ku Klux Klan, so you can be sure that every white racist in the country voted for Trump, but there are millions of other decent people who have reasonable concerns about a movement like Black Lives Matter.  Most of these people probably voted for Trump too.  These people are not racist they were simply recoiling from charges of racism and from a toxic brand of identity politics.  Much of what has been coming out of the left, not everything, but much of it, particularly about race, and about law and order, and about Islamophobia, and about terrorism, about issues that are fundamental to the security of our society, has had all the moral clarity and intellectual honesty of the OJ verdict.  Which is to say none at all.  I’m confident that many people don’t perceive Trump to be a dangerous conman, in the way that I do, probably voted for him out of sheer exasperation.  They were sick of being called racists for not worrying about Halloween costumes on our Ivy League campuses.  So millions of these people, along with real racists, told all you whinging social justice warriors at Yale and Brown to go fuck yourselves.  And can you really blame them?  I mean, safe-spaces, trigger warnings, new gender pronouns, getting Muslim student groups to de-platform speakers like Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Bill Maher.  Was that the cause of your generation?  That’s the trench you’re willing to die in?  The question is; would a Democratic campaign that leaned even further to the left have prevailed further in this situation?  I doubt it, and does Sanders have anything sensible to say about foreign policy?  Would he have been to address fears about terrorism.  It certainly didn’t seem that way at the time.  I suspect that this really is the crux of the issue.  At least it’s the main reason why even those who saw Trump’s flaws didn’t care about them.  The problem that worried me the whole time is the left’s total failure to speak honestly about Islam and terrorism and the refugee crisis in Europe.  This I think was decisive.  Certainly, it was one of the things that had it gone the other way would have given us a different result.
. . .


I'd say Harris gives some good criticism in the last paragraph quoted above about the moral bankruptcy and cowardice of the left — thought I'm not sure he fully realizes the implications of what he is saying, since this is the group with which he has aligned himself — 'what does that liberal elite think'?

But in any case, no one knows, including Sam Harris, if Democrats saying something sensible about foreign policy would have been decisive, or given us a different result.

Back to 'The Most Powerful Clown'

https://www.samharris.org/podcast/item/the-most-powerful-clown
. . .
Admittedly, it seems strange to cite polls at this point, but what else can I do?  The exit polls show that the people who said their primary concerns were terrorism and immigration, voted overwhelmingly for Trump.  Whereas those who concerned about the economy or foreign policy voted for Clinton.  So, it wasn’t “the economy stupid” this time around, though economic fears certainly played a role.  And it wasn’t just poor whites who supported Trump.  The median income of Trump voters was $72,000.  And I think that in this election concerns about terrorism and immigration largely boiled down to a concern about Islamism, and to the fear and distrust provoked by liberal lies about it.  Immigration means other things of course, but I don’t think it’s mainly that there a lot of white people whose median income is $72,000 who want to pick strawberries for a living.  If my collisions on social media told me anything over the last year, it’s that many people were nearly single issue voters when it came to Islam.  I would bet that this accounts for many more people than voted for third-party candidate.  Which was also probably decisive.  The fact that we have a president who wouldn’t even use the phrase “Islamic extremism”, who could even say things like “terrorism has less to do with Islam than any other religion”, right, and the fact that Clinton seemed to embrace this delusion, even though she did on occasion use the phrase “radical jihadism”, as though that made any sense.  That was a terrible problem.  And of course the fact that she and her husband have taken tens of millions of dollars from the Saudis and other Islamist regimes didn’t help.  Couple that with this unexplained desire to increase the number of Syrian refugees by 550% without ever acknowledging what is going wrong in Europe.  This was a deal breaker from many people, and I heard these people endlessly over the last year.

And the problem of course is people are right to be worried about Islamism and Jihadism, and all the left has offered on this point are lies, and sanctimony and charges of racism and bigotry.  Worrying about Islam more than any other religion at this moment is not a sign of racism or bigotry.  Muslims themselves should be worried more about Islam at this moment than about Mormonism, Anglicanism, or Judaism.  This is basic human sanity, and most people know it.  But Clinton was the sort of politician, who in the immediate aftermath of the Orlando massacre, spoke only about gun control, and then issued grave warnings about a rise in Islamophobia.  When we had just suffered yet another jihadist atrocity on American soil.  This was unforgivably stupid.  And I knew it at the time that this was the sort of stupidity that could pave the way for Trump.  I even wrote a section of a speech that I thought Clinton should give about Islamism and jihadism, and put it on my blog.  It would have been so easy for her to have made sense on this issue, and to have differentiated a sane understanding of jihadism from bigotry against Muslims in general.  But she couldn’t do it.  She wouldn’t do it.  All of these things contributed to her loss, and to the rise of Trump.
. . .


It is interesting that Sam Harris would call out the tens of millions of dollars the Clinton's have received from Saudi Arabia, and other authoritarian, Islamist regimes, but Harris leaves out the more important point that arms sales to those same regimes jumped under Hillary Clinton's tenure as Secretary of State, for the period October 2010 to September 2012 —
     http://maxautonomy.blogspot.com/2016/09/paul-krugman-and-hillary-clinton-birds.html

And again, it is fascinating that Sam Harris does not seem to know who he is aligned with — I know he is not a fan of Hillary Clinton (only claiming that she is supposedly a much lesser evil, when compared with Trump) — but did Harris really have any expectation that a politically correct, career politician, would take a stand against one of the world's dominant religions?

Any expectation that Hillary Clinton would not mention a propaganda term like 'Islamophobia' positively, strikes me as pure delusion.   Of course, Hillary Clinton did not come out with criticism of Islam, after an act of Islamic terrorism.

Why on earth would anyone expect her to do that?

Back to 'The Most Powerful Clown'

https://www.samharris.org/podcast/item/the-most-powerful-clown
. . .
So the question now is, how do we move forward having to declare the next president to be an absolute jackass, and a sexual predator?  And as I’ve said in a previous podcast a liar of the sort one would only expect to find in a mental hospital?  How do we move from making jokes about placing the nuclear codes into the hands of a dangerous narcissist to actually placing the nuclear codes into his hands?  Well, I’m afraid we just do.  And we hope that this man who appears to lie about everything, has also been lying about how awful a person he is.  Let’s hope he isn’t who who he has seem to be.  Let’s hope that he really is a cipher, let’s hope he was only pretending not to believe in climate change.  Let’s hope that he was only pretending to admire Vladimir Putin.  Let’s hope that he was only pretending to believe the sorts of conspiracy theories that helped get him elected.  Let’s hope he really is a con man without any core commitments, other than to maintain his own fame and glory.  Because then there’s a chance that knowledgeable people might be able to influence him.

I thought president Obama struck the right note yesterday, we all must hope for Trump’s success at this point.  We want his presidency to be a good one.  It’s as if we’re all on an airplane together, and the real pilot has died.  And now a man who has never flown an airplane has taken over the controls, and is attempting an emergency landing, and we’re all stuck in the back of the plane.  So we’re rooting for the man in the cockpit.  Of course, before he got his hands on the controls, some of us complained about how unqualified he was.  There were a few other people back here with a lot of time spent flying planes.  But this guy stormed the cockpit, and now he’s in the pilot seat, and the runway is in view, and we are out of time.  So let’s hope he’s talking to people in air traffic control.  The problem of course is, it actually matters who is in the tower.  Just think about who Trump has surrounded himself with — Rudy Giuliani, Chris Christie, Sarah Palin, Mike Pence — this is a clown car of ideologues and incompetents with a couple of religious maniacs thrown in.  But again we want him to land this plane and it doesn’t have to be pretty.  It doesn’t matter if we all wind up covered in vomit.  We will be grateful just to be alive.  And I will be very grateful if after four years Donald Trump hasn’t set back human progress a generation.

This may all sound like hyperbole, but who knows what sort of mistakes this man is capable of.  And if you said that about Clinton, you were just wrong.  Even with all her flaws we have no idea who Trump is, or what he will do.  He probably doesn’t even know.  But we do know that he has less understanding about the responsibilities he’s about to assume than any president before him.  Indeed, he has less understanding than any candidate most of us have ever conceived of.  So, let’s hope he’s a quick study, and let's hope there are thousands of good people who are willing to work for him.  Which brings up a point I saw raised on social media by a few people — no matter how horrified you are by this result, no matter how judgmental you are of the people who enabled him, people like Paul Ryan, you have to hope that the best people available will come forward now, and be willing to serve in Trump’s administration.  People with good reputation and real expertise.  We can’t afford to question the motives and integrity of anyone who would join this administration.  We want the best people we can get in the door.  We have to hope that being president of the United States brings out the best in Donald Trump.  Campaigning for the presidency brought out the worst, it showed what he’s like as an embattled narcissist and fabulist and demagogue, but now he's won, right?  Now he will be surrounded by people seeking the warm glow of his power, now he will inspire fear, actual fear not merely scorn in his critics.  He is no longer just a clown, he is the most powerful clown on Earth.  We have to hope that winning to this degree will pacify some of his demons.  Is there a historical or psychological precedent for this?  I have no idea.  But we’re about to find out what happens to a man with a famously, palpably, visibly unhealthy ego, who suddenly triumphed over everyone who ever doubted him.  This is a man who when he voted in New York, at his polling place, got jeered by a crowd on Tuesday.  In a city that voted 87% against him, and one day he’s going to ride back into town on Air Force One — imagine the way his ego feels right now.  Just imagine the satisfaction Trump will feel when he takes possession of the White House and shows president Obama the door.  The first black president who humiliated him in front of all the Washington elites at the White House correspondents dinner.  Go watch footage of that, all those laughs at his expense.  Trump has been a punchline for decades.  He’s been the Rodney Dangerfield of billionaires, but that moment with Obama at the podium was the worst.  And now he gets to tell Barack Hussein Obama to get out of his house and then tear his legacy to shreds.  You’ve got the first black president being shown the door by a man who always questioned his legitimacy in racist terms, and has been endorsed by the KKK.  Only Shakespeare could do this moment justice.

So, while Trump seems like he could become some sort of Caligula with an iPhone, we have to hope that our democratic institution will restrain him.  That the awesome responsibilities thrust his way, the responsibility of running a superpower will bring out the better angels of his nature, if he has any.  So I think normalizing this mess might be the best we can do for the time being. Needless to say, a pendulum swing into left wing identity politics will not be helpful, but it seems extremely likely to occur.  In fact it’s already happening with these ridiculous protests under the banner of “Not my president”.  Good luck with that.

How many of you voted for a third-party? Or didn’t vote at all?  What we need are smart ethical people in the political center, who can defend freedom of speech and science, and the norms of civil discourse from their enemies on both the right and the left.  And so far as I can do anything useful in that area, I will do my best.  That is part of what this podcast is for.  And if you guys have any ideas about who I should talk to on the podcast about the fate of civilization, I will be very happy to hear your ideas.  And I promise I will be getting to interesting topics totally unrelated to politics, in fact I will mostly do this.  Because what I say about politics doesn’t seem to do much.

As always you can support the podcast at samharris.org/support, and you can also support it on a per episode basis at patreon.com/samharris.  About 2% of listeners regularly support the podcast now, and I’m hoping to bring that up to 10% — that will be a game changer.  And if you are already a supporter, please know that your help is greatly appreciated.  And once again thanks for listening, until next time.


And here is the ultimate payoff from the hours of Sam Harris's podcasts denouncing Trump — notice this quote from Harris in the center paragraph above —
"And if you said that about Clinton, you were just wrong."
If you do not agree with Harris on this, you cannot be correct — even if Harris cannot explain why.

And, ironically, all this from the author of a book on the harm of lying
     https://www.samharris.org/blog/item/new-ebook-lying

As an interesting comparison, notice that both Sam Harris and Andrew Sullivan exude what Thomas Sowell described as 'The Vision of the Anointed', in that they have a vision, or world view, that they wish to enforce on others via a political process, and verifying that view with evidence is not an important concern —
     https://duckduckgo.com/?q=thomas+sowell+the+vision+of+the+anointed
     https://fee.org/articles/the-vision-of-the-anointed-self-congratulation-as-a-basis-for-social-policy/

Monday, November 7, 2016

The Sam Harris Fail

Quoted below is a blog post from October 2016, by the well-known atheist Sam Harris, entitled 'Trump in Exile'.   This blog post is perversely fascinating, in that it was written by a man who gained fame primarily as an atheist and supposed guardian of rationality, in his critiques of religion.  For example, see Harris's books 'The End of Faith' and 'Letter to a Christian Nation'.

The striking thing about Harris's blog post quoted below, is that Harris wrote nothing to support his hyperbolic conclusion that a Trump presidency would be a monumental disaster in comparison to a Hillary Clinton presidency.  Harris just seems to expect readers to believe it, because he does

https://www.samharris.org/blog/item/trump-in-exile2

Trump In Exile
Sam Harris   OCT 13, 2016
It is a cliché, of course, to claim that a presidential election is the most important in living memory.  But we arrived at that point in the 2016 campaign many months ago, when both sides declared their opponent unqualified for office.  Unfortunately, this time the cliché is true, and one side is actually right.  A choice this stark proves that there is something wrong with our political system.

Hillary Clinton is a terribly flawed candidate for the presidency, and this has allowed millions of otherwise sane Americans to imagine that she is less fit for office than Donald Trump is.  Much depends on a majority of the electorate seeing through this moral and political illusion in the weeks ahead.
. . .


This may be the most important presidential election in living memory, but you would not know it from anything Harris wrote later in his blog post.  Sadly, Harris gives no indication that his melodrama is even worthy of consideration — despite his claim that this is 'the most important presidential election in recent memory'.  Well, if Harris really believes that, he might have worked a little harder at making a convincing case — it should not have been that hard, given 'a choice this stark', as he put it.

Note that I am making no attempt here to defend Trump — I am pointing out that Harris has not given his insults substance, and so they are ad hominem attacks.  Harris does provide some specifics about Trump's 'sexual predations', but they are useless as a point of comparison with Hillary Clinton, since, as Harris acknowledges below, Bill Clinton 'can probably match Trump indiscretion for indiscretion'.

According to Harris, Hillary is obviously massively better than Trump, but at the same time she lacks the character to leave a marriage to a Trump equivalent.  I know Hillary's supporters love to dismiss this obvious criticism — since Bill Clinton isn't running for president — but it is pretty nonsensical to claim that Hillary's character is markedly superior to Trump's, while simultaneously making the claim that Hillary's character is such that she made a Trump equivalent her lifelong partner.

Well, at least Harris openly acknowledged that Hillary Clinton is 'terribly flawed' — but that phrase is a euphemism that amounts to a terribly flawed attempt at demonstrating objectivity.  It has been well documented that Hillary Clinton's behavior has been criminal, so referring to her as 'terribly flawed' does not do justice to the terrible things she has done.  You can read more about that here —
      http://maxautonomy.blogspot.com/2016/09/paul-krugman-and-hillary-clinton-birds.html
      http://maxautonomy.blogspot.com/2016/08/lying-about-hillary-clintons-lies.html
      http://maxautonomy.blogspot.com/2016/07/mediamatters-hillary-clintons-shill.html

The Clintons at Donald Trump's wedding in 2005.
The Clintons at Donald Trump's wedding in 2005.

More from 'Trump in Exile'

https://www.samharris.org/blog/item/trump-in-exile2
. . .
To consider only one point of comparison: We have now witnessed Donald Trump bragging about his sexual predations in terms that not even Satan himself could spin to his advantage.  He has admitted to repeatedly groping women, kissing them on the mouth without their consent, and invading the dressing rooms of teenage pageant contestants to see them naked.  Every day, more women come forward confirming the truth of these confessions.  Trump has even said that he would have sex with his own daughter, were she the offspring of another man.  He talks about his libido as only a malignant narcissist can: as though it were a wonder of nature, a riddle no mortal can solve, and a blessing to humanity. 

Such disclosures should have ended Trump’s presidential campaign.  But as luck would have it, Hillary Clinton is married to a man who can probably match Trump indiscretion for indiscretion.  Indeed, Donald Trump and Bill Clinton are both trailing serious accusations of rape.  Whether or not the worst of these charges are true, these are not normal men.  Each has lived for decades as a roving id flanked by a security detail.  Each is the very avatar of entitlement.  However, only one of these cads radiates contempt for nearly every other member of our species.  Only one has made humiliating people—and women in particular—a central part of his brand.  Only one lives a troubled adolescent’s fantasy of what a man should be, exposing a ruinous insecurity and moral emptiness every time he opens his mouth.  Most important, only one of these men is running for president today.  And, personal ethics aside, only one is dangerously unfit for the job.

While Trump’s attitude toward women should be disqualifying, it is among his least frightening traits when it comes to assuming the responsibilities of the presidency.  His fondness for Vladimir Putin, the whimsy with which he has entertained the first use of nuclear weapons, his disregard for our NATO alliances, his promise to use federal regulators to harass his critics, his belief that climate change is a hoax, his recommendation that we kill the families of terrorists, his suggestion that America might want to default on its debt—any one of these sentiments should have ended Trump’s bid for public office within the hour.  In fact, Donald Trump is so unfit for the presidency that he has done great harm to our society by merely campaigning for it.  The harm he could do from the White House can scarcely be imagined.
. . .


Again, raising Trump's 'sexual predations' as an issue to support your description of 'a stark choice' is pretty ridiculous, when you are forced to acknowledge that the person you are defending married Trump's equal in that regard.  If that supposed fact destroys any reasonable support for Trump, how will Hillary Clinton be able to function properly as President, being married to a Trump equivalent?

If Trump's attitude toward women is disqualifying as Harris wrote, then Hillary marrying the likes of Trump should also be disqualifying, and so Harris still has not provided a reason to think that Hillary is the lesser evil, despite his hyperbolic claim to the contrary — so far, all Harris has done is waste the reader's time.

And the last paragraph quoted above is too filled with unsubstantiated accusations to be worth unpacking — it functions as code to those who already agree with Harris, and share his bias, so it begs the painfully obvious question —
      Who is Harris trying to convince by dropping a laundry list of unsubstantiated accusations?

Does Harris really believe that voters, who are honestly struggling to sort through all of the constant political corruption, would read that list, and say to themselves, 'Oh yeah, now it's obvious'?

Harris mentioning the use of 'federal regulators to harass his critics', for example, seems like a kind of psychological projection, given the recent IRS scandal with Lois Lerner — again, this does not defend Trump, but it certainly does nothing to defend the notion that Hillary is the obvious choice, or that you have fallen prey to a 'political and moral illusion', as Harris put it, if you do not vote for Hillary.

Or how about the claim that Trump believes global warming is a hoax?   Is Harris really blind to the problems there, or does he believe that all voters are blind?  Why would Harris bring up such a scandal ridden topic, as if it were a defining advantage for Hillary?  It does not take much digging to find good reasons to be skeptical about the claims regarding global warming — like, say, the holes in the supposed 'settled science', or the problems with fraud in the research —
     http://maxautonomy.blogspot.com/2015/04/global-warming-zealots-and-intellectual-dishonesty.html
     http://www.nationalreview.com/article/424875/getting-rich-climate-extremism-ian-tuttle
     http://dailysignal.com/2016/03/02/...audit-detailing-climate-change-researchers-double-dipping-with-taxpayer-funds/
     https://www.google.com/search?q=Jagadish+Shukla+RICO

And how about the claim from Harris that Trump believes the U.S. might want to default on its debt?  Well, it is not as simple as Harris would like his readers to believe.  Here is an account of Trump's statements on the debt from NPR
     http://www.npr.org/2016/05/09/477350889/donald-trumps-messy-ideas-for-handling-the-national-debt-explained

One could try to argue from reading that NPR piece that Trump's statements were not practical, or even that they did not make any sense — but Trump did not suggest a U.S. default, as Harris wrote.

     http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2016/may/16/closer-look-donald-trumps-comments-about-refinanci/
Trump: "No. I don't want to renegotiate the bonds. But I think you can do discounting, I think, you know, depending on where interest rates are, I think you can buy back.  You can -- I'm not talking about with a renegotiation, but you can buy back at discounts, you can do things with discounts.  … I would refinance debt.  I think we should refinance longer-term debt."
Is that why it seems to be 'a choice this stark' to Harris — because he cannot really tell what the choice is?

Back to 'Trump in Exile'

https://www.samharris.org/blog/item/trump-in-exile2
. . .
But hatred for both Clintons is now so blinding as to render Trump’s far more dangerous flaws imperceptible to millions of Americans.  This is deeply disconcerting.  Ask yourself, How would Trump appear if he were a malicious bully? The answer: Exactly as he does now.  The man lies about everything, and yet he can’t even pretend to be a good person for five minutes at a stretch.  How would Trump sound if he knew nothing about world affairs? One need only hear him speak to know.  The truth is that Trump couldn’t have displayed his flaws more clearly during this campaign had his goal been to humiliate himself.  And yet this hasn’t mattered to nearly half the electorate.

As many others have noted, there was a point in the second presidential debate when Trump’s campaign ceased to be a depressing farce and became the terrifying, national disgrace we now see before us.  The crucial moment wasn’t when Trump threatened to imprison Clinton if he wins in November—it was the shriek of joy this threat produced in half the audience.  That was the sound of our democracy unraveling.  And there was Trump, the crazed man-child tearing at the threads.

If there is a silver lining here, it is that many of us now see how vulnerable our political system is to charlatanism, conspiracy theories, and populist unreason on both the Right and the Left.  The role that the media has played, rendering us all moths to the Trumpian flame, will be scrutinized for years to come.  The truth about us is sobering: We have been playing with our smartphones while hurtling toward the abyss…

Hillary Clinton will almost certainly be the next president of the United States.  And, with any luck, she will usher in four years of exquisite boredom.  Unfortunately, the toxicity of this campaign seems unlikely to dissipate.  There will be a surplus of anger to be discharged—not just among disappointed Trump supporters, but toward them.  Those who stood with Trump, as the wrecking ball of his ego swung dangerously through our lives, will likely find that their reputations have been destroyed.  I will be surprised if we hear anything from Chris Christie or Rudy Giuliani ever again.  Trump himself should be forced into exile the way OJ Simpson was after he was falsely acquitted of two murders.  In fact, one might say that a murder has been committed here—of the public good—by a monster of selfishness and self-regard.

After November, let the shunning of Donald Trump be complete.



'Hatred for both Clintons is now so blinding' — really?   In a piece filled with invective against Trump?   Is this more psychological projection from Harris?   How about the blinding hatred of Trump, including from Sam Harris?

And regarding 'the shriek of joy' when Trump threatened to imprison Clinton — perhaps there are people who understand that Hillary Clinton committed a crime, and they care about the rule of law —
     http://maxautonomy.blogspot.com/2016/07/mediamatters-hillary-clintons-shill.html

If you think Hillary Clinton is innocent, then — if you want to be convincing — you have to try and make that case.   But attempting to pretend that others are simply craven, because they think Hillary should be imprisoned for committing a felony is not a convincing defense of your position that Hillary is the lesser evil.

Here is Sam Harris in a podcast complaining that people have accused him of committing an ad hominem attack against Trump.  Harris spends several minutes addressing this accusation, and in attempting a rebuttal, he simply makes more emotional ad hominem attacks, by repeating his insulting, but empty denunciations — 'dangerously unintelligent', 'pathological liar', etc.

Harris does not seem to understand that calling someone a 'pathological liar', for example, in no way provides any indication that the person being denounced is actually a liar, never mind pathological — in the early parts of the podcast, Harris seems quite annoyed that anyone would not accept his list of adjectives and analogies as evidence to support his claims —
     https://www.samharris.org/podcast/item/the-lesser-evil

And it should be stressed, that even if everything Sam Harris says about Trump is true, it still does nothing to defend his position that Hillary is the lesser evil, because Harris makes no attempt to convince anyone that Hillary does not possess all of the same bad character traits — Harris simply insists that Hillary's corruption is not as bad, and expects everyone to agree.

In the podcast, Harris and Andrew Sullivan actually have a long discussion about just how bad both Bill and Hillary are, in an attempt to do a real comparison with Trump, in order to show that Trump really is the greater evil.  That conversation is quite odd, in that, at one point, Harris states that he found nothing shocking about the corruption revealed by the Podesta e-mails, stating something to the effect of, ' ... that is how the sausage gets made', as if corruption is intrinsic to the political process, rather than the product of corrupt individuals.

That should give you a sense of how convincing Sam Harris is at defending Hillary as the lesser evil.  But certainly don't take my word for it — go listen to the podcast, if you have a couple of hours you can afford to waste.

And, again, notice that I have said nothing positive regarding Trump.  I have no doubt that he has lied — just like Hillary — but this claim from Harris that Trump is 'pathological', and so Hillary is the clear choice in this regard, is indefensible —
     http://maxautonomy.blogspot.com/2016/08/lying-about-hillary-clintons-lies.html

And the duration of the podcast is even somewhat comical, at about 2.5 hours long — the conversation between Harris and Andrew Sullivan wandered randomly through a number of topics, as if anything either of them have to say is always important — and guess what one of their conclusions was — that Trump is a narcissist!   Introspect much Sam?

Ah, yes, that 'Trumpian flame' — perhaps Sam Harris is the one who is fixated by it.

Here is a very polite video from a previous admirer of Sam Harris, that is devastating in its critique of the intellectual dishonesty Sam Harris displays in his denunciations of Trump.  As I attempted to do with the Sam Harris blog post above, Odysee user 'Computing Forever' carefully tears apart (and in much greater detail than I did) the complete lack of substance Sam Harris provides in denouncing Trump —



For a more reasonable take on the significance of the 2016 election, consider this article by David Harsanyi at reason.com
      http://reason.com/archives/2016/11/04/this-is-the-least-important-election-of
... It certainly goes for Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump, neither of whom possess the requisite talent, vision or charisma needed to destroy this country in a mere four years.  Yet on Tuesday in Dade City, Florida, Clinton finally stated what many in her party (from the president to students to 96-year-old Roger Angell) have been saying for months: "I believe this may be the most important election of our lifetimes." For her, yes.  For the rest of us, not so much.
I almost wish the 2016 U.S. Presidential election was as important as Sam Harris thinks it is — that would mean it might be possible to solve some terribly difficult problems with the election of a single person.  Now that is a political and moral illusion.

Saturday, November 5, 2016

Our Wretched Situation

In a previous post, I lamented about the lack of respect that the typical American shows for the U.S. Constitution.  I may have made it sound like this is something new, but obviously that is not the case.

'The Debates in the Several State Conventions on the Adoption of the Federal Constitution' is a five-volume collection of the U.S. Constitutional debates held at Philadelphia in 1787, compiled and arranged by Jonathan Elliot in 1836.

From the 'Library of Congress'
The volumes remain the best source for materials about the national government's transitional period between the closing of the Constitutional Convention in September 1787 and the opening of the First Federal Congress in March 1789.  On September 17, 1787, the Continental Congress accepted the recommendation of the Constitutional Convention and agreed to distribute the proposed constitution to the states; each state was then to elect delegates to a state convention to approve or disapprove the new constitution.  The Constitution would take effect upon ratification by the conventions of nine of the thirteen states.
Here is a quote from James Madison, beginning on page 536 of volume 3 of 'The Debates in the Several State Conventions on the Adoption of the Federal Constitution', where Madison states that no form of government can render us secure if the people do not 'have virtue and intelligence to select men of virtue and wisdom' to serve in government —

http://oll.libertyfund.org/titles/1907#Elliot_1314-03_1143
http://oll.libertyfund.org/titles/madison-the-debates-on-the-adoption-of-the-federal-constitution-vol-5
...
I have observed that gentlemen suppose that the general legislature will do every thing mischievous they possibly can, and that they will omit to do every thing good which they are authorized to do.  If this were a reasonable supposition, their objections would be good.  I consider it reasonable to conclude that they will as readily do their duty as deviate from it; nor do I go on the grounds mentioned by gentlemen on the other side — that we are to place unlimited confidence in them, and expect nothing but the most exalted integrity and sublime virtue.  But I go on this great republican principle, that the people will have virtue and intelligence to select men of virtue and wisdom.  Is there no virtue among us?  If there be not, we are in a wretched [537] situation.  No theoretical checks, no form of government, can render us secure.  To suppose that any form of government will secure liberty or happiness without any virtue in the people, is a chimerical idea.  If there be sufficient virtue and intelligence in the community, it will be exercised in the selection of these men; so that we do not depend on their virtue, or put confidence in our rulers, but in the people who are to choose them.
...


If it wasn't clear when Madison made this claim, it should be clear by now that the overwhelming majority of people do not 'have virtue and intelligence to select men of virtue and wisdom'.  We are much closer to a 'wretched situation' from a lack of virtue than Madison thought.

If the 2016 U.S. Presidential debates do not convince you of that, consider the 13th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, and its relationship to the prior amendments in the 'Bill of Rights'

https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/overview
https://www.loc.gov/rr/program/bib/ourdocs/13thamendment.html
https://memory.loc.gov/mss/mal/mal3/436/4361100/001.jpg
https://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/ampage?collId=mal&fileName=mal3/436/4361100/malpage.db&recNum=0
Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
The 13th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, from The Abraham Lincoln Papers at the Library of Congress


Also notice that the 13th Amendment initially failed to receive the required two-thirds majority vote.  Here is a portion of Abraham Lincoln's Fourth Annual Message to Congress, from the Congressional Globe, from December 6, 1864 —

https://www.loc.gov/rr/program/bib/ourdocs/13thamendment.html
https://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/ampage?collId=llcg&fileName=069/llcg069.db&recNum=696
"At the last session of Congress a proposed amendment of the Constitution, abolishing slavery throughout the United States, passed the Senate, but failed for lack of the requisite two-thirds vote in the House of Representatives.  Although the present is the same Congress, and nearly the same members, and without questioning the wisdom or patriotism of those who stood in opposition, I venture to recommend the reconsideration and passage of the measure at the present session."
Portion of Abraham Lincoln's Fourth Annual Message to Congress, from the Congressional Globe, December 6, 1864


Now consider the 4th and 5th Amendments to the U.S. Constitution —

https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/fourth_amendment
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/fifth_amendment
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.


The 13th Amendment makes absolutely no sense in comparison to the 4th and 5th Amendments, and helps to undercut the notion that the U.S. Constitution grants a limited set of powers to government, such that the Constitution should not contain an exhaustive list of protected rights — this is the point of the 10th Amendment.

A common fear when the 10th Amendment was written was probably not nearly common enough — despite the 10th Amendment, the overwhelming majority of Americans view the Constitution as a list of restrictions, rather than a list of granted powers, such that government can do anything (even defend slavery), if the U.S. Constitution does not specifically prohibit it by name.

That is, the 13th Amendment is redundant, in that it simply emphasizes what the U.S. Constitution already said about depriving a citizen of life, liberty, or property.  The institution of slavery was absurd on its face, and no Constitutional amendment would have been required, had the overwhelming majority of Americans took Constitutional protections seriously.

Notice the high bar placed on the U.S. Government by the 4th and 5th Amendments, for restricting when government can interfere with the lives of private citizens.  Never mind the 5th Amendment's requirement that 'due process of law' is a prerequisite for citizens being 'deprived of life, liberty, or property', the 4th Amendment requires government to issue a warrant simply to search a private citizen.

Given these restrictions, one has to do incredibly contorted mental gymnastics to come to the conclusion that, in the absence of the 13th Amendment, it is Constitutional for one private citizen to own another.

The 13th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution may as well read —
'Uh, you know that stuff about being secure in your person, and not being deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law?  Well, we really mean it this time.'
Given how little respect most Americans gave for Constitutional protections in the past, it is not clear why anyone would think an overwhelming majority of Americans would respect those protections now.

Obviously, many do not.

Here are massively uninformed Hillary supporters who do not understand that the question being asked was invented to highlight voter ignorance.  And ironically, the typical Democrat views Trump as the danger




I predict that some will accuse me of defending slavery, because I argue here that the U.S. Constitution did not permit slavery, with or without the 13th Amendment.  If you are familiar with social media (or now, really news in general), and so-called 'social justice warriors' (SJWs), you are familiar with that kind of dishonesty (insane spin to fit a particular agenda).